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**WJCraig** · 09-10-2009, 09:24 PM

**stamp** · 09-11-2009, 12:06 AM

did they beep out fund???

88fadedglory · 09-11-2009, 12:07 AM

Yep, really great plan . . .

No heath care for me becaue I'll be too old, too many health probs, and because I'm not a Liberal ... along with every other senior citizen, of course.

No health care for anyone with health issues from the womb.

Major delays for treament and even bigger for surgeries.

US taxpayer funded abortion on demand for every woman on the whole planet. Selective sterilization is implied also for minorities, poor, etc.

But that's what you want us to have, isn't it, Craig? The same system you've got in Canada that costs human lives right and left, many of whom would be saved by the current system here in the US.

Why is it that people from all over the world come to the US for surgeries? Because they can get it in a reasonable time frame ... like, before they die.

Oh, and I almost forgot: big unaffordable fines for the poor if they can't afford health insurance. Nothing like a good flogging to someone already dying.

Budd

**stamp** · 09-11-2009, 12:17 AM

i know its bs ... obama is a socialist no way around it... im sure thats not what he wants he was just showing us a funny clip ....

right?

88fadedglory · 09-11-2009, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cad

i know its bs ... obama is a socialist no way around it... im sure thats not what he wants he was just showing us a funny clip ....

right?

I find nothing Obama does or says funny ... just scary.

Budd

**stamp** · 09-11-2009, 12:28 AM

well when he does cause total anarchy in the united states we can all just head for the hills

**littleblackxj** · 09-11-2009, 01:33 AM

hahaah thats great!

**WJCraig** · 09-12-2009, 11:15 AM

Actually Budd...It's just a little bit of comedy with some cleverly censored words to make it sound like he's saying something else....

You should however check your facts before trying to attack our system...But I'm really not interested in another debate about Canada Vs. The U.S. so I'll leave it at that...

Here's more in the same spirit...

YouTube - Unnecessary Censorship #185 Jimmy Kimmel Live 12-12-08

YouTube - Unnecessary Censorship #186 on Jimmy Kimmel Live 12-19-08

Have a laugh, Enjoy...or don't...Whatever....

Later.

88fadedglory · 09-13-2009, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WJCraig

Actually Budd...It's just a little bit of comedy with some cleverly censored words to make it sound like he's saying something else....

You should however check your facts before trying to attack our system...But I'm really not interested in another debate about Canada Vs. The U.S. so I'll leave it at that...

Have a laugh, Enjoy...or don't...Whatever....

Later.

Craig,

Not many years ago an American tourist died because Canada's socialist medical system failed to get them to a hospital in time. The hospital was 100 miles away and it took over 5 hours.

About the same time, a tourist had a heart attack in the remotest part of Arches National Park outside Moab UT. Allen Memorial Hospital, one of the smallest in the state, got a chopper from Grand Junction CO (100 miles away) in the air and sent an ambulance to the Park for the patient. They met and transferred at the main gate to the Park and the patient was undergoing surgery 2 hr 15 min after the call came in.

How do I know? My wife was working the ER and took the call from the patient. The Canadian instance was in US papers and on the news.

Now you can say all you want about your government, but you should also look into the foundations of our system. I suggest:

Christianity: Lifeblood of America's free society (1620-1945)

By:

John A. Howard

ISBN 978-0-936163-49-9

And like I said, I find nothing funny about Obama, even when words are put in his mouth.

**WJCraig** · 09-13-2009, 02:13 PM

You can find a case here or there where the system has failed somebody in any country. I know of a case here where one of our citizens in the US died because the ambulance did not take him to the hospital right away because they were more interested in finding out weather or not he was insured first. Because of the delay, he did not make it. I know because my wife was working for the company that insured him. Now that we can each show that there are people who sometimes die needlessly on either side of the border, let us leave it at this:

Neither system is perfect, all systems have flaws. Now, you have two options:

1) You can be open minded to new ideas and look at ways to improve a system.
2) You can put blinders on and say everything is tickety-boo.

Now, nowhere here am I suggesting that you should follow one system or another. As far as I know, nobody has a "perfect" system.

Look up a few stats (that are based on numbers, not opinion) about various countries and the health of their citizens around the world. If you find that your country is constantly on top of the charts, then I say it is a good system and should be left alone. If you find other counties seem to have better statistics, then perhaps you might do better to look at ways to try to improve the system, rather then wasting energy in finding fault with others.

I'm not at all saying you should adopt our system or anybody elses. But I know that improvements that can be made to any and all systems. This is not an "Us Vs. Them" thing, and nobody is trying to screw you. People are just trying to improve things for everybody. You may not necessarily agree with how they are going about it, and may have other ideas on how to do it, but I truly believe that is the motivation.

Look what'cha did now...you baited me into replying to this topic...

88fadedglory · 09-13-2009, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WJCraig

You can find a case here or there where the system has failed somebody in any country. I know of a case here where one of our citizens in the US died because the ambulance did not take him to the hospital right away because they were more interested in finding out weather or not he was insured first. Because of the delay, he did not make it. I know because my wife was working for the company that insured him. Now that we can each show that there are people who sometimes die needlessly on either side of the border, let us leave it at this:

Neither system is perfect, all systems have flaws. Now, you have two options:

1) You can be open minded to new ideas and look at ways to improve a system.
2) You can put blinders on and say everything is tickety-boo.

Now, nowhere here am I suggesting that you should follow one system or another. As far as I know, nobody has a "perfect" system.

Look up a few stats (that are based on numbers, not opinion) about various countries and the health of their citizens around the world. If you find that your country is constantly on top of the charts, then I say it is a good system and should be left alone. If you find other counties seem to have better statistics, then perhaps you might do better to look at ways to try to improve the system, rather then wasting energy in finding fault with others.

I'm not at all saying you should adopt our system or anybody elses. But I know that improvements that can be made to any and all systems. This is not an "Us Vs. Them" thing, and nobody is trying to screw you. People are just trying to improve things for everybody. You may not necessarily agree with how they are going about it, and may have other ideas on how to do it, but I truly believe that is the motivation.

Look what'cha did now...you baited me into replying to this topic...

No, I didn't bait you ... you could have not not brought the subject up knowing there was this rednecked old boy in CO that couldn't pass up a chance to say what's on his mind.

Btw, I was taught about socialism by a few experts: middle school had two WWII vets teaching social studies and civics (one served in Europe and the other hit Omaha Beach, 9th and 10th grades-a Korean vet, 12th grade- WW-II (Omaha Beach) and Korean war vet.

And I grew up in post-McCarthy US and watched the socialistic governments fall down in their care for the poor and elderly worldwide.

Read the book, Craig, and see what your government hasn't figured out and can't if it remains socialist.

In this country, social programs were church run and worked fine until liberals and socialists decided to put them out of business and tax the citizenry to run them.

I can remember an old country doctor we had before I went to school (1953)that made house calls (!!!!!) and took what the family could afford as payment, even if it was a chicken or a slab of bacon, but he gave everyone the same care.

Budd

flawlesslydisturbed · 09-13-2009, 05:48 PM

Health care is a joke unless you have deep pockets. I don't have any insurance right now because of pre existing problems and they want to charge me over $200 a pay.

I have had a back problem for a year and a half because every time I went to the doc or E.R. they wouldn't x-ray or ct scan because I don't have insurance. When they finally gave me ct scan they acted like I was an idiot for letting the problem go so long. I can't win.

Even when I did have coverage I couldn't see the doctors I wanted because the insurance company made me go to the ones they picked. It was more of a hassle to drive 60 or more miles to approved health care than paying the entire bill myself at a closer location.

It really sucks to pay for insurance for years without any problems just to find out they won't cover this or that when something does happen.

I know a few people that have a medical card through welfare or job and family services and it covers just about anything. That's good for the people who need it but I also know people that are capable of working and don't that get the card and I can't get any assistance because I make too much money. Why can't they offer this to everyone that really needs help. It's almost worth quiting my job, getting coverage and fixing my problems then going back to work.

If Obama can fix this screwed up system, I'll personally kiss his ass on national t.v.

**WJCraig** · 09-13-2009, 08:20 PM

Budd,
when I said you baited me it was in more of a joking or sarcastic tone. I should know by now that doesn't come through in text...So don't take it as any more then that because it is not meant to be anymore then that (Although, I think you understand that based on the "redneck" comment, but just to be clear...).

As for the rest of what I said, look at flawlesslydisturbed's post. That is just one reason why the system needs improvement. I'm not saying improvement is our system, or anybody else's. What I am saying is that improvements need to be made. I know I don't have the answer, but what I do know is it won't be found by "poo-pooing" my county.

Don't make us come down there and light up the White House again, like we did last time y'all tried to mess with us!

Later.

Later.

88fadedglory · 09-14-2009, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flawlesslydisturbed

Health care is a joke unless you have deep pockets. I don't have any insurance right now because of pre existing problems and they want to charge me over $200 a pay.

I have had a back problem for a year and a half because every time I went to the doc or E.R. they wouldn't x-ray or ct scan because I don't have insurance. When they finally gave me ct scan they acted like I was an idiot for letting the problem go so long. I can't win.

Even when I did have coverage I couldn't see the doctors I wanted because the insurance company made me go to the ones they picked. It was more of a hassle to drive 60 or more miles to approved health care than paying the entire bill myself at a closer location.

It really sucks to pay for insurance for years without any problems just to find out they won't cover this or that when something does happen.

I know a few people that have a medical card through welfare or job and family services and it covers just about anything. That's good for the people who need it but I also know people that are capable of working and don't that get the card and I can't get any assistance because I make too much money. Why can't they offer this to everyone that really needs help. It's almost worth quiting my job, getting coverage and fixing my problems then going back to work.

If Obama can fix this screwed up system, I'll personally kiss his ass on national t.v.

The problem with health care is it's become too specialized and that leads to specialists thinking they're worth more than anyone else. In a word: it's about "greed".

Insurance companies have decided that anyone with a prior problem, like you or myself, is too big of a risk. Obama's plan is just as faulty because once you become a certain age, regardless of your condition, you're a liability and not a human being, or if your wife is carrying a child that has so much as a minor defect (a missing little finger, for example) then the child is terminated aka. killed.

Why?? Because it cuts into the bottom line: profits ... aka "greed".

I take a medication (Metformin / Glocophage) for my Diabetes that contains a whopping $0.10 of actual medication But a non-generic 30 day prescription is about $150, or $5.00 each tablet. At Wal Mart on the $4 program, the same medication is $0.13 / tablet. And Wally World isn't in it for the fun of it, they're making money on the deal.

Why are medications so high? Greed.

Now some of the greed can be traced back to liberal trade and labor unions with unreasonable demands for the employees they represent but those costs to the corporations gets sent on to the consiumers, the sickies on fixed income like myself that can't afford the high prices.

Budd

88fadedglory · 09-14-2009, 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WJCraig

Budd,
when I said you baited me it was in more of a joking or sarcastic tone. I should know by now that doesn't come through in text...So don't take it as any more then that because it is not meant to be anymore then that (Although, I think you understand that based on the "redneck" comment, but just to be clear...).

As for the rest of what I said, look at flawlesslydisturbed's post. That is just one reason why the system needs improvement. I'm not saying improvement is our system, or anybody else's. What I am saying is that improvements need to be made. I know I don't have the answer, but what I do know is it won't be found by "poo-pooing" my county.

Don't make us come down there and light up the White House again, like we did last time y'all tried to mess with us!

Later.

Later.

So.. I guess you don't understand that I'm a descendant of a long line of Kaintucks and Tennesseans (my Redneck ancestory) who was unfortunately born north of the Mason/ Dixon, along with Scot/Irish ancestries and a few ancestors that met the Mayflower in the harbor and are now wondering why they let it drop anchor. My blood runs red, white, and blue.

I'm sorry, but you are beginning to underwhelm me with your wit, humor and, especially, you own understanding of governments and social policies, especially, the original design of the Representative Republic called the United States of America.

That's why I suggested that book. It was an attempt to help you understand that if the US stays true to the founding fathers, we don't need socialist / liberal / communist programs.

But if you don't read it, then you'll never understand our government as well as you could, imho.

I'm dropping out of this thread. I'm fed up and ticked off.

Budd