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86rokee · 01-17-2010, 04:35 AM

i just realize my Dw doesnt affect my steering wheel, normally it has in the past on other jeeps ive had. does this point to something else causing it, all my steering parts have been replaced with new stuff. i added a set of used 33s thats when the problem started, i rotated the tires and it made no differance. the toe in was set , we matched the casters to my friends similarly lifted zj, tightened up the steering box but at 40mpg like clockwork it start to slowly wobble then full on dw but the steeringwheel doesnt move back and forth.
to note the trac bar hasnt been replaced, it doesnt seem bad but i just read something that makes me think it is bad. when i turn my steering wheel with the jeep parked if i turn it back and forth the body moves around too, this isnt normal is it?

drakan1908 · 01-17-2010, 11:57 AM

When I turn my wheels the body does move a little, just in response to the wheels moving. How much is yours moving? I would replace the trackbar with an adjustable one.

Carl · 01-17-2010, 09:15 PM

Usually if the steering wheel isn't getting the feedback then it's not DW...

86rokee · 01-18-2010, 04:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl

Usually if the steering wheel isn't getting the feedback then it's not DW...

yes i agree, we put the 33s on my buddys beat to hell chopped zj and it drove like a caddilac as he said so its not the tires, infact i put on a know good track bar way tighter than my old one and put my 30s back on and it wanted to wobble at 40mph still which it didnt do a week ago with those tires. other than the used track bar and used rancho steering sapbalizer all my tie rods, draglink, pitman tierod are all brand new. so im suspecting its not death wobble caused by steering components, so then what would it be? it does shake the hell out of the jeep just like dw, my axle ujs are a few months old, my drivelines are all old, i wonder if i have a bent driveline from when the jeep was in a ccident before i got it. my drivers side motor mount is cracked in the center. a guy said this cause dw for him, a bad mount. ive never heard of it. its cracked not floating around so much.
so really its bearing, ball joints and driveline and mounts. its driving me nutts. i just keep putting more and more money into stock parts to no avail.

86rokee · 01-18-2010, 04:43 AM

what about a bad front shock(s) could this cause this?

**muddeprived** · 01-18-2010, 09:53 AM

Motor mount will not cause death wobble. It will cause DEATH for your jeep (at least a temporary death).

Did you have your buddy turn the wheels back and forth while you checked the front end joints. Check every single joint for play.

My body does not move when I turn the wheels. If your body moves then it sounds like the trackbar cuz that keeps the body and axle centered.

Are you sure you have the death wobble? Death wobble is when your tires start VISUALLY shaking back and forth BADLY and you have no choice but to slow down and stop. A slight wobble over a bump is not death wobble. I'm not saying you are wrong but alot of people misunderstand what death wobble is.

Bounce on the front of your bumper and count how many rebounds the jeep takes to stop bouncing. If it takes two or more bounces to stop then your shocks may be bad but if it stops within one or two rebounds then they are fine. This is an old trick I was taught back when I was younger.

One little trick you can do to figure out WTH is wrong with your front end is to hook up a camera right under your front bumper facing the steering and go for a drive while it records. You'll be able to see what's shaking or moving that shouldn't be. I saw a couple vids on youtube of people doing this to figure out their death wobble.

86rokee · 01-18-2010, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muddeprived

Motor mount will not cause death wobble. It will cause DEATH for your jeep (at least a temporary death).

Did you have your buddy turn the wheels back and forth while you checked the front end joints. Check every single joint for play.

My body does not move when I turn the wheels. If your body moves then it sounds like the trackbar cuz that keeps the body and axle centered.

Are you sure you have the death wobble? Death wobble is when your tires start VISUALLY shaking back and forth BADLY and you have no choice but to slow down and stop. A slight wobble over a bump is not death wobble. I'm not saying you are wrong but alot of people misunderstand what death wobble is.

Bounce on the front of your bumper and count how many rebounds the jeep takes to stop bouncing. If it takes two or more bounces to stop then your shocks may be bad but if it stops within one or two rebounds then they are fine. This is an old trick I was taught back when I was younger.

One little trick you can do to figure out WTH is wrong with your front end is to hook up a camera right under your front bumper facing the steering and go for a drive while it records. You'll be able to see what's shaking or moving that shouldn't be. I saw a couple vids on youtube of people doing this to figure out their death wobble.

i checked it out closer today and what happens is when you max out the steering wheel it sucks the body down compressing the coil springs, yea, crazy.so its not moving side to side it moves down. what hapens is when i hit about 40mph my jeep starts to shake, and if i dont stop right away it will go into full on DW. attaching a camera , not the way this shakes, it wont be on there after a case of dw.
its probably my caster angles, which i have no idea how to set correctly.
with . or is it just to set the pinion angle my angle is pretty good, driveline doesnt look bent, my shocks are good. i undid them and compressed them and they were hard to compress, and sprung back as i let go.
i did notice when i undid my track bar at the axle and had a freind turn the steering wheel back and forth my drivers side upper control arm was making a poping sound and moving around. it sounded like metal to metal poping sound. cant see if its damaged, but it wasnt when i swapped it in a few months back.
so just to confirm again, when my jeep shakes i have to pull over ato make it stop or almost completely stop, unlike the Dw i had before its predictable and not sudden.and it starts a bit slower but is just as violent. i can slow down before i have full on dw, before it made little differance and it was unpredictable as to when it would do it. i cannot go over 40mph, not any time, never, its dw everytime. the other times i had it it was sudden, usually changing lanes or hitting pot holes. so anyways maybe the upper lca is bad ill remove it later and look at it

86rokee · 01-20-2010, 11:19 PM

i pulled both upper control arms off, im not sure what im looking for but they both look pretty normal to me. the bolt does fit tighter in one than the other, but i dont see it being the cause of the dw. the fact that the body moves somewhat when turning the steering wheel seems wrong to me. my gear box does leak, always has. but i dont want to go replacing a gear box just because it leaks a little bit hoping its the problem. im tired of throwing parts at this thing. my driveline doesnt seem bent but how would i tell? anyone know besides using a dial indicator to check for out of round/radial runout.
im about to just sell this jeep and get a differant one, im tired of just emptying every pocket here!!!

**muddeprived** · 01-21-2010, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 86rokee

i pulled both upper control arms off, im not sure what im looking for but they both look pretty normal to me. the bolt does fit tighter in one than the other, but i dont see it being the cause of the dw. the fact that the body moves somewhat when turning the steering wheel seems wrong to me. my gear box does leak, always has. but i dont want to go replacing a gear box just because it leaks a little bit hoping its the problem. im tired of throwing parts at this thing. my driveline doesnt seem bent but how would i tell? anyone know besides using a dial indicator to check for out of round/radial runout.
im about to just sell this jeep and get a differant one, im tired of just emptying every pocket here!!!

How about you list every part you have on your front end and also get some pictures of the front end, as many as you can of each part so we can see what's gong on a little better. It's hard to help ya without seeing what's going on. It would be sweet to have a video of the steering issue that moves the jeep when you turn.

cubanater · 01-21-2010, 09:29 AM

are u running stock upper and lower control arms

86rokee · 01-21-2010, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muddeprived

How about you list every part you have on your front end and also get some pictures of the front end, as many as you can of each part so we can see what's gong on a little better. It's hard to help ya without seeing what's going on. It would be sweet to have a video of the steering issue that moves the jeep when you turn.

ill get some pics after i get home from school.

new:
drag link
tre at pitman arm
tre at passengerside knuckle
tre at driverside knuckle
new moog sway bar bushings
new axle ujoints both sides

cubanater · 01-21-2010, 09:39 AM

well i was having the dw real bad... i went ahead and installed aftermarket uca and lca, that cut my dw almost all the way, i tweaked my track bar and now i have no dw at all... if ur running a lift without control arms that could be it

86rokee · 01-21-2010, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cubanater

well i was having the dw real bad... i went ahead and installed aftermarket uca and lca, that cut my dw almost all the way, i tweaked my track bar and now i have no dw at all... if ur running a lift without control arms that could be it

stock control arms, what did you do to your track bar exactly just slide it over?

heres some basic pics of my front end nothing too close up, ill get better ones later.

89xj4.7 · 01-21-2010, 01:02 PM

mine did some this. thought it was dw. but knew it wasnt as bad as the dw i had when my shock bushing went bad. (upper bushings) after checking everything i looked at my front drive shaft. the front U-joint was trashed... replaced it and fixed the problem.....

good luck with yours.

**muddeprived** · 01-21-2010, 03:17 PM

You have a stock pitman arm on there right?

I read your original post and you said the wobble started right after you put on those 33's. Do you have another set of tires you can use to drive around and test? If the wobble started right after the tires were put on then I would think the tires are bad.